37 replies to this topic

[1337hunt3r]

Hey guys, I've been thinking about this topic for a while and I've come to the conclusion that ABing is not safe, unless I'm somehow misinterpreting how AB'ing works or TNT is completely stupid.

I am under the impression that AB'ing works like this:
Abrosia waits for a certain amount of time (between 2 fixed amounts) and refreshes until a desirable item is found.
Abrosia then waits some more, clicks on the item, waits even more, and finally purchases the item.
It switches to a different store after 300 refreshes.

Here are the main issues of AB'ing:
1. Normality. It is reasonably safe to assume that the distribution of time it takes for a human being to refresh is approximately normal (this is a common phenomenon). However, my observations show that Abrosia apparently does not implement this; If I enter 8 to 10 seconds as the waiting time, it will wait a random amount of time between 8 to 10 seconds, with each time having equal probability.
2. Accuracy. Abrosia switches stores exactly every 300 refreshes - this is a pretty clear indicator that somebody is using a program. What kind of legit AB'er counts exactly how many times they refresh in one store then switches to another store after 300 refreshes? This is pretty ridiculous if you ask me.
3. Endurance. Many of us often leave Abrosia on for long periods of time, meaning that it's refreshing every few seconds, without breaks, for hours at a time. Regular human beings are incapable of doing this. There is just no way you can refresh at a screen every day for hours without getting bored or tired.
4. Fatigue. Even if you could refresh for hours a time, you're going to be tired at the end of that marathon, which will result in slower reflexes and longer refresh rates. Unless you're pumping red bull into your system the whole time, your speed will decline.

This is why it surprises me that TNT is so ineffective at catching AB'ers, even with all the dead giveaways.
Any input on this topic is appreciated. Discuss.

[Donaldmax]

I dont think TNT has the time to do this. It would just waste more time because the person that was frozen would make up a bunch of excuses that TNT would be unable to prove that he/she used ab. Therefore, TNT would basically waste their time by freezing then unfreezing. Not worth it in my opinion.

[rhexis07]

I'll answer 3 & 4 If you hadn't notice, there's actually a Scheduler tab in Abrosia which I believe, many people, especially people who can't be bothered to explore Abrosia a little more, misses it.

People who leave Abrosia on for many hours of course risk themselves getting caught more than someone who actually has a schedule plan. For me, example, if I wanted to on Abrosia over night, I would plan a schedule. Every 40-50 minutes, I'd let Abrosia take a 10-15 minutes break, sometimes 20. Just a very irregular break so Abrosia doesn't run 5 hours straight, which is obviously ridiculous.

And once you have a schedule, then number 4 will no longer be relevant because you've had your 10-15 minutes break. You had your chance to get up, relax a little, drink a cup of Mountain Dew, close your eyes, whatever. No one is asking you to AB for hours straight. And I actually think that you're thinking superbly deep into everything when I read Q4.

Edited by rhexis07, 09 May 2011 - 10:17 PM.

[1337hunt3r]

Time? That's what scripts are for.
Sure it's hard to keep track of millions of accounts, but they could just keep records of accounts that have bought UB's from the main shops.
1 Week of logging would be a substantial amount of evidence to freeze somebody, and they wouldn't even need to listen to requests because it's just impossible for a human being to be consistent in their RS'ing for so long.

[rhexis07]

Time? That's what scripts are for.
Sure it's hard to keep track of millions of accounts, but they could just keep records of accounts that have bought UB's from the main shops.
1 Week of logging would be a substantial amount of evidence to freeze somebody, and they wouldn't even need to listen to requests because it's just impossible for a human being to be consistent in their RS'ing for so long.

Really? Back when Faeries were priced at 300-500 @ the Magic Shop, I would just restock like crazy for hours there. Just plan a schedule and everything will be better.

And obviously, if you're cheating, you're running a risk of getting caught, no matter what. Nothing comes easy in this world.

Edited by rhexis07, 09 May 2011 - 10:20 PM.

[Mystery]

They would rather try and find more ways to use the NC mall to drain your $ than to care for ABers...unless you are going suicide ABing

[1337hunt3r]

I'll answer 3 & 4

If you hadn't notice, there's actually a Scheduler tab in Abrosia which I believe, many people, especially people who can't be bothered to explore Abrosia a little more, misses it.

People who leave Abrosia on for many hours of course risk themselves getting caught more than someone who actually has a schedule plan. For me, example, if I wanted to on Abrosia over night, I would plan a schedule, let's say, every 40-50 minutes, I'd let Abrosia take a 10-15 minutes break, sometimes 20. Just a very irregular break so Abrosia doesn't run 5 hours straight, which is obviously ridiculous.

And once you have a schedule, then number 4 will no longer be relevant because you've had your 10-15 minutes break. No one is asking you to AB for hours straight. And I actually think that you're thinking superbly deep into everything when I read Q4.

Ah, but scheduling puts you at even a greater risk. How is it feasible for somebody to log in and RS at the exact same times every week? It's not.
I never run Abrosia overnight; that's just too dangerous. But even in the day, every hour is about 500 refreshes, and that enough should put you in the red for points #1, #2, #4.

Really? Back when Faeries were priced at 300-500 @ the Magic Shop, I would just restock like crazy for hours there. Just plan a schedule and everything will be better.

And obviously, if you're cheating, you're running a risk of getting caught, no matter what. Nothing comes easy in this world.

Okay, sure you can restock for hours, which once again brings me to points #1, #2, and #4. Can you keep your refreshing rate in a 5 second interval for hours and switch shops exactly every 300 refreshes?

Of course there are risks to cheating, I'm just wondering why TNT hasn't implemented a better system to catch cheaters when it seems so easy.

Edited by 1337hunt3r, 09 May 2011 - 10:25 PM.

[qweable]

About the fatigue thing, back when I had too much time and too little things to do, Id just sit in front of my computer refreshing constantly at a few stores two to three hours for a few days. Just make sure you dont go overboard and AB for 8 hours straight everyday without taking any breaks.

[rhexis07]

Ah, but scheduling puts you at even a greater risk. How is it feasible for somebody to log in and RS at the exact same times every week? It's not.
I never run Abrosia overnight; that's just too dangerous. But even in the day, every hour is about 500 refreshes, and that enough should put you in the red for points #1, #2, #4.

Erm....It's not feasible...so who asked you to follow a certain schedule with the exact same time every day? Are you going to be THAT strict as to follow a schedule completely? Set one today, another tomorrow, another the day after, for different hour, different minutes. That's what I do.

I set times like 4:04 - 4:43pm, then 5:10 - 5:52pm, etc etc today. The next week, I'll set a different one.

[1337hunt3r]

They would rather try and find more ways to use the NC mall to drain your $ than to care for ABers...unless you are going suicide ABing

This is a good point. I guess TNT just doesn't value their community anymore then.

About the fatigue thing, back when I had too much time and too little things to do, Id just sit in front of my computer refreshing constantly at a few stores two to three hours for a few days. Just make sure you dont go overboard and AB for 8 hours straight everyday without taking any breaks.

You never got tired of pressing the same button over and over again for hours? Your reflex rate didn't decrease as time went on? I wish I had your endurance.

[Mystery]

This is a good point. I guess TNT just doesn't value their community anymore then.

Only after viacom took over,I believe.

[rhexis07]

This is a good point. I guess TNT just doesn't value their community anymore then.


You never got tired of pressing the same button over and over again for hours? Your reflex rate didn't decrease as time went on? I wish I had your endurance.

Well then, if you want to be REALLY safe, set the time interval for refreshes to 8-30 seconds. That way, it's unlikely for you stay at a shop for 300 refreshes as Abrosia for non-Advanced Members fixes its time such that the maximum time spent at a shop is 45 minutes. And at the same time, plan a schedule. That'll reduce the chances of you getting caught by at least 3/4? That is, if you're willing to come back after 5 hours and see nothing except for random events logged on your Abrosia.

[qweable]

You never got tired of pressing the same button over and over again for hours? Your reflex rate didn't decrease as time went on? I wish I had your endurance.

Got bored rather than tired. Thats why you take breaks every now and then.

[1337hunt3r]

Well then, if you want to be REALLY safe, set the time interval for refreshes to 8-30 seconds. That way, it's unlikely for you stay at a shop for 300 refreshes as Abrosia for non-Advanced Members fixes its time such that the maximum time spent at a shop is 45 minutes. And at the same time, plan a schedule. That'll reduce the chances of you getting caught by at least 3/4? That is, if you're willing to come back after 5 hours and see nothing except for random events logged on your Abrosia.

As you said, you need quick refresh rates if you want to actually buy something. Consistent quick refreshes for long periods of time is suspicious.
Most people don't go through all that precaution anyways, so as of right now, detecting AB'ers should be as easy as pie.

Got bored rather than tired. Thats why you take breaks every now and then.

Even with breaks, I still find it amazing that you can sit at your computer and press a single button for hours a day.

Also, nobody has said anything about point #1.

Edited by 1337hunt3r, 09 May 2011 - 10:41 PM.

[qweable]

Even with breaks, I still find it amazing that you can sit at your computer and press a single button for hours a day.

Like I said, I had too much time and had nothing to do... Time well spent if you ask me XD

[1337hunt3r]

Like I said, I had too much time and had nothing to do... Time well spent if you ask me XD

Holy shit.

[Kuraz]

Even with breaks, I still find it amazing that you can sit at your computer and press a single button for hours a day.

well to be honest, when restocking legitly, I watch videos while refreshing. so basically i just sit in front of the computer for the whole day (if I am free)

my current schedule is to AB for 2 hours and then take a break of 1 hour; so when doing legit I in fact look more illegit

[without123]

Its fine to AB if you don't go more than 2hours without taking a break. Go on and off /like a normal person would/. Neo generally won't notice aswell if you have a higher refresh rate, making it inconsistent also helps.

[Kyle]

Thousands of users online at once. They aren't going to notice anything unless you are kicking ass in magic.

[without123]

Yeah. And if they DO check you out, at least have a decent shell to make yourself look more legit

Edited by without123, 09 May 2011 - 11:31 PM.

[simplicity155]

how exactly did you get hte 300 refreshes? a lot of people tend to use manual times or just switch whenever they get a good unbuyable, there are many ways to try to avoid getting banned
inevitably you are using a program so ther is always a chance of getting banned

there is also this conspiracy that they dont care too much since they get profit from all the pages we visit haha

[anbeezy]

I agree with all of the above, they simply don't have the resources, time, and or care to actually take into account many of these factors for every single player. They only pay attention to very very hardcore aber's who's time are ridiculous, etc. You are multiple times more likely to get frozen for cheating on flash games than ab'ing. Conclusion: be smart about using your ab'er.

[sc4fps3]

Hey guys, I've been thinking about this topic for a while and I've come to the conclusion that ABing is not safe, unless I'm somehow misinterpreting how AB'ing works or TNT is completely stupid.

I am under the impression that AB'ing works like this:
Abrosia waits for a certain amount of time (between 2 fixed amounts) and refreshes until a desirable item is found.
Abrosia then waits some more, clicks on the item, waits even more, and finally purchases the item.
It switches to a different store after 300 refreshes.

Here are the main issues of AB'ing:
1. Normality. It is reasonably safe to assume that the distribution of time it takes for a human being to refresh is approximately normal (this is a common phenomenon). However, my observations show that Abrosia apparently does not implement this; If I enter 8 to 10 seconds as the waiting time, it will wait a random amount of time between 8 to 10 seconds, with each time having equal probability.
2. Accuracy. Abrosia switches stores exactly every 300 refreshes - this is a pretty clear indicator that somebody is using a program. What kind of legit AB'er counts exactly how many times they refresh in one store then switches to another store after 300 refreshes? This is pretty ridiculous if you ask me.
3. Endurance. Many of us often leave Abrosia on for long periods of time, meaning that it's refreshing every few seconds, without breaks, for hours at a time. Regular human beings are incapable of doing this. There is just no way you can refresh at a screen every day for hours without getting bored or tired.
4. Fatigue. Even if you could refresh for hours a time, you're going to be tired at the end of that marathon, which will result in slower reflexes and longer refresh rates. Unless you're pumping red bull into your system the whole time, your speed will decline.

This is why it surprises me that TNT is so ineffective at catching AB'ers, even with all the dead giveaways.
Any input on this topic is appreciated. Discuss.

1. You assume that someone is going to do nothing but stare at their computer screen for hours at a time. If they did that, and were not distracted at all, then maybe the distribution would be normal. But people are going to do other things, and their refresh times are not going to be a normal distribution. The randomness is fine.
2. Advanced membership solves this problem. Scheduled your times and change the amount of time spent in one shop. Problem solved.
3. Again, scheduler.
4. I agree with this, but only to a certain point. If you turn the ABer on for an hour or two and just let it run (which is how most people probably do it), then yeah, this could be suspicious and unrealistic. However, in the past couple of days I've had the time to monitor the shop(s) that I was restocking in while playing Neopets legit, and only when I saw that there were free item slots for a restock did I load up Abrosia for ~15 minutes max. Alternatively, you could schedule that, but you would be less accurate in coinciding with shop restocks. You have a point here, but again, scheduling can help quite a bit.

[Kat]

Protip? TNT really doesn't give a fuck If you're being extremely obvious of course they will freeze you, but most of the time they'll just randomly freeze someone just to scare us back in line.
I digress. Some people here have earned 100 mil+ or leave it on for 8+ hours a day or have crazy buy times and still have yet to be frozen.
So how do you keep your account safe? You don't. AB on a shell and don't cry when you get frozen.

[zandra]

1. Normality. It is reasonably safe to assume that the distribution of time it takes for a human being to refresh is approximately normal (this is a common phenomenon). However, my observations show that Abrosia apparently does not implement this; If I enter 8 to 10 seconds as the waiting time, it will wait a random amount of time between 8 to 10 seconds, with each time having equal probability.
2. Accuracy. Abrosia switches stores exactly every 300 refreshes - this is a pretty clear indicator that somebody is using a program. What kind of legit AB'er counts exactly how many times they refresh in one store then switches to another store after 300 refreshes? This is pretty ridiculous if you ask me.
3. Endurance. Many of us often leave Abrosia on for long periods of time, meaning that it's refreshing every few seconds, without breaks, for hours at a time. Regular human beings are incapable of doing this. There is just no way you can refresh at a screen every day for hours without getting bored or tired.
4. Fatigue. Even if you could refresh for hours a time, you're going to be tired at the end of that marathon, which will result in slower reflexes and longer refresh rates. Unless you're pumping red bull into your system the whole time, your speed will decline.

This is why it surprises me that TNT is so ineffective at catching AB'ers, even with all the dead giveaways.
Any input on this topic is appreciated. Discuss.

1.you can increase the time to 8-20 seconds to make it look more random =)
2. 300 refreshes are if you set the timer to 45 minutes and the system calculates that the refresh rate will cause approximately 300 refresh. if you change the refresh rate or time spent, the number of refresh changes.
3. this is why scheduler is in there. you set the time you want to ab. and insert breaks in between.
4. once again. this is why there is a scheduler. you can always choose to ab short hours.


TNT plainly catches ABers (from what i know obvious tell tale signs)
1.you refresh ab @ 1-2 seconds and buy items in less then 1 seconds aka obvious botting speeds.
2.Purchase 40 UBs in a day( crazy amounts)
3.AB 3 days in a row with no breaks (running 24 hours a day)

you prob would not get frozen because regular member is protected from the first 2.